Suggestion 2.5 Paldea Starters Questline

[vartio]

Lemme start with the obvious: each Starter Generation requires something unique in order to obtain them. While Gen 2 is available via quests, I wanted to suggest these as part of a short but efficient questline.


QUEST DETAILS

When Players enter Olivine City, they are given the option to undertake a Quest. This quest will involve facing a (random/player chosen?) Ceruledge or Armarouge that has broken out on the Pier. When the player faces this pokemon, it Terastalizes (only possible in this questline and not to become a standard site mechanic). Players must defeat this Ceruledge/Armarouge, and upon completion the users gain access to 3 more quest battles - as they learn from their faction (if they joined one, otherwise a random member of the Ship's staff) that it and three other pokemon from Paldea were poached into Johto. In addition, a copy of that Evolution's Armor is found that the pokemon was carrying, now given to the player to evolve their Charcadets, along with 10 Tera Shards of their choosing.

It is noted after the fact that when investigated, the Pokemon above was able to Terastalize because it had eaten and disolved a Tera Orb - likely against its will - and it was a one-off event and that now that it was unconscious the effect was gone.

These three quests involve battles with Skeledirge (Ecruteak/Burnt Tower), Quaquaval (Goldenrod City), and Meowscarada (Azalea Town), whom all Terastalize into their individual Starter type as part of the battle. These encounters should include a number of other trainers out to capture these pokemon for themselves. These Pokemon will be uncatchable for the player, for any reason available (Org picks them up instead, Player 'captures' them just to return them to Olivine, etc). However, beating them will leave their Respective Starter's Egg (it's only 4 more levels to run through!) that the player can pick up and bond with.

Note/Reminder: These NPC Pokemon are the only ones that can/will Terastalize, they are akin to those wild 'fixed' encounters in Sc/Vi, but uncatchable. The Mechanic is not to be publically available.
===================================

With that, I go back to this other thing I was doing. *FORESHADOWING!*

[Tarlar]

Interesting idea, that could be a really good base ^^ It needs some work of course, and I have some concerns for some of it.

Things which needs to be fleshed out: Is this one quest, or three different ones in different places which have the same basic setup? Sounds a bit like its Mr Pokemon quest which is technically in Cherrygrove but you "travel" to New Bark through the thread.
If they are happening in different places, they seem to be three different quests, and then I personally would prefer there to be some difference in between them, since otherwise it can be tedious to do the same exact story again and again for the other two. If they are one, I assume they should be redoable, and then we need some sort of limit. A wait time and a lesser price if redone.
They could also just be some trainers pokemon, who got spooked (or chased/lured away for some other reason) and the Member needs to help get them back to their trainer?

About terastalliation. Luckily the damage calculator seems to have it included, because otherwise it would have been impossible to do. I can't find any sprites of them though, which would be a shame I think, might be doable without if we're alright with the normal ones.
Any thoughts on which tera type they would have all of them? Is it random, linked to the starter they are after, or set from the start?
Why/how can they teralize when there are not in Paldea? Running around with Tera orbs or something?

I think having Ceruledge and Armarouge as fine teasers, although I think the evolved form of the starters would work just as well. I will say no to getting the armor for beating them, it feels out of place when the focus isn't charcadet and you can't expect everyone to have the pokemon, or being interested in getting it, and then no use for the armor. The armor is also already available in the RT shop like all other evolution items, that must be good enough ^^
I would also worry that people would just to the first part of the quest and then drop it just for the free armor.
Tera shards are fine as a prize for the first one, but not 10 of your choosing then you have all you need in one go, that's too easy. Especially when you can do the quest at least 3 times! Either fewer choosable or 10 random ^^
In the festival lotto you could choose, while beating Nemona gave 10 random

We need some fleshing out when it comes to finding the starters, since just popping to the area and then fighting the tera version of them is rather boring in my mind For chikorita you travel through a lot of Ilex to find an item to save both the sick grass starter and lift the curse of the forest as an example.
It could be linked to the starters themselves. Meowscarada could be something about making it jealous or making tricks/Magician. Skeledirge could be something about singing, and Quaquaval could be something with dancing.
It could be a bit open to leave some creativity for the member, where we could give some hints and suggestions. When the pokemon is lured out, they could request/demand it to follow them home, the pokemon refuses (for whatever reason), and the battle can start to get it home anyway.

As for the final reward, I will not recommend it being an egg. While we're some who love eggs, not everyone does and will not like the hassle of having to both hatch and train a level 1. Beside, as a tier 4, you'll either need a daycare or need to spent 5000 pokedollars to get an incubator to be able to hatch it in the party, that's not fair.
All other starters are level 10, so I will recommend that as well. Also, the starter they get could be included in the quest, either by helping the member, or aiding the fully evolved one (doesn't need to battle the unevolved one.) That could be a way to help set the three quests apart too, with what the first one can help with.

[vartio]

Apr 14, 2024 8:07:07 GMT 11 Tarlar said:

Interesting idea, that could be a really good base ^^ It needs some work of course, and I have some concerns for some of it.

Things which needs to be fleshed out: Is this one quest, or three different ones in different places which have the same basic setup? Sounds a bit like its Mr Pokemon quest which is technically in Cherrygrove but you "travel" to New Bark through the thread.
If they are happening in different places, they seem to be three different quests, and then I personally would prefer there to be some difference in between them, since otherwise it can be tedious to do the same exact story again and again for the other two. If they are one, I assume they should be redoable, and then we need some sort of limit. A wait time and a lesser price if redone.
They could also just be some trainers pokemon, who got spooked (or chased/lured away for some other reason) and the Member needs to help get them back to their trainer?

About terastalliation. Luckily the damage calculator seems to have it included, because otherwise it would have been impossible to do. I can't find any sprites of them though, which would be a shame I think, might be doable without if we're alright with the normal ones.
Any thoughts on which tera type they would have all of them? Is it random, linked to the starter they are after, or set from the start?
Why/how can they teralize when there are not in Paldea? Running around with Tera orbs or something?

I think having Ceruledge and Armarouge as fine teasers, although I think the evolved form of the starters would work just as well. I will say no to getting the armor for beating them, it feels out of place when the focus isn't charcadet and you can't expect everyone to have the pokemon, or being interested in getting it, and then no use for the armor. The armor is also already available in the RT shop like all other evolution items, that must be good enough ^^
I would also worry that people would just to the first part of the quest and then drop it just for the free armor.
Tera shards are fine as a prize for the first one, but not 10 of your choosing then you have all you need in one go, that's too easy. Especially when you can do the quest at least 3 times! Either fewer choosable or 10 random ^^
In the festival lotto you could choose, while beating Nemona gave 10 random

We need some fleshing out when it comes to finding the starters, since just popping to the area and then fighting the tera version of them is rather boring in my mind For chikorita you travel through a lot of Ilex to find an item to save both the sick grass starter and lift the curse of the forest as an example.
It could be linked to the starters themselves. Meowscarada could be something about making it jealous or making tricks/Magician. Skeledirge could be something about singing, and Quaquaval could be something with dancing.
It could be a bit open to leave some creativity for the member, where we could give some hints and suggestions. When the pokemon is lured out, they could request/demand it to follow them home, the pokemon refuses (for whatever reason), and the battle can start to get it home anyway.

As for the final reward, I will not recommend it being an egg. While we're some who love eggs, not everyone does and will not like the hassle of having to both hatch and train a level 1. Beside, as a tier 4, you'll either need a daycare or need to spent 5000 pokedollars to get an incubator to be able to hatch it in the party, that's not fair.
All other starters are level 10, so I will recommend that as well. Also, the starter they get could be included in the quest, either by helping the member, or aiding the fully evolved one (doesn't need to battle the unevolved one.) That could be a way to help set the three quests apart too, with what the first one can help with.

So it's 4 quests. The initial quest is when you go to Olivine for the intro for whatever reason. This is Armarouge/Ceruledge. They will be Psychic/Ghost Terra, respectively.  This is only a singular fight to 'wet the toes' so to speak to give a people of what awaits in the further 3 Quests. There's no prelude battles in this initial quest, because the idea is there's so much Chaos going on and the pokemon's raising full hell. The reward being an armor of choice and 10 tera shards is small in comparison to what lies ahead - and are unique to this phase. (Perhaps a Tera Blast TM too but that may be too much for a opening step in a quest chain). The armor may not be useful then, but it has trade worth and it has worth as I understand that the Armors will be potentially faction-locked, UNLESS you use the RT Shop. 

Agreed on 10 random for the shards btw. The choice was a spitball suggestion when I posited the idea to Lamont.

----------------------------------

When it came to the later 3 quests, I imagined the situations based on the Sprout Tower (albeit without battling with the basic forms of the three). Because by this point, you'd have people who heard about the Olivine Pier incident out to capture these Rare Pokemon. So on top of facing these other trainers whom are also looking for (and could leave clues of noises they saw or info on these pokemon that are unnative to the region), you may have Wild Pokemon who are disturbed by the situation and drawn out from DEEP in their areas and higher nuisances (level) then usual.

IN my mind these 3 Evolved Forms are at the time unowned, but you won't capture them anyhow for whatever reason. Either the Tera Power resists Pokeballs until they feint, or there's a request not to catch them to return them to the wilds (and their children were unknown of), worth figuring out. The idea was again they were meant to be provided to buyers in Johto who wanted to capture these rare, exquisite pokemon from Paldea. (Who these buyers are could even link into future questlines).

Having to 'draw them out' through their individual traits is something nice, and I can agree with that. Having the basic versions help you would too - they likely know the scents of the Stage 2 forms (their parents), and probably the Tera Shards you have on you from the quest if you didn't use them yet (maybe excessive, maybe even 'feed' them the Tera Shards via a technique taught to you by the Ship's Chef back during the intro quest into a sandwhich to 'pay' for the egg, so 10 shards per quest, although this feels excessive).

As for their Tera-Types we got two choices. Either they use their Teras offensively to augment their special moves (Flower Trick, et al), or defensively to their sub-types to throw trainers off their weaknesses. On one end, nothing more terrifying than a Meowscarada with a TERA-STAB Flower Trick. On the other makes for a more interesting challenge as these clearly Grass/Fire/Water pokemon are, despite the trainer's foreknowledge, now entirely different approaches to battle. I would lean Defensive and the three change combat strategies too after.

With the Basic forms accompanying and bonding with the trainer during these quests, this also means we can drop the whole Egg Reward and give them directly to trainers as well. 

Adding alternative clears sounds nice, but I'd be wary about the 'safe' answer being easily accomplished. These Pokemon were just poached across the ocean and implied to have been fed the crystals in Tera Orbs as their 'food' to enable at least temporary Terastilization to 'up their value' to the buyers in the region. They should be wary as can be of humans.

----------------------------

On a final note: are you able to finnagle pokemon's stats? IE: Could we give them a larger HP pool ala Titan Pokemon, Eternatus, or Terapagos? Make these feel more like challenges that way.

[Caramell 🍬]

I like the idea of 3 quests - one for each starter. But to be honest, the prize is out of place in this quest and doesn't feel very suiting. And definitely not for just beating the Armarouge that's it, then you get the evo-item (start of first quest) if I'm reading it right. Maybe a different prize OR more work to obtain it? This would then be 4 quests?

Armarouge Quest though...is it added just to get the Evo item? It feels. Idk. I don't see the strong connection to the starters myself especially since factions don't matter. Maybe an RNG'd chance to get the Evo item (1/6) but then we'd need the quest to be repeatable and make sense that it's repeatable in case the first time your odds just aren't that good. (Luck out of getting the item the first round) or it would be unfair if you could never try again.

10 Tera Shards - sounds like this has been worked out to be randomized now? Would be much better. Maybe they can be randomized according to types on the player's WHOLE team if we want it to make more since lore wise why they're getting these specific Tera Shards. It does mean players could finagle team set ups specifically for certain Tera Shards, but they would also need them for the battles too just for the reward at the end, kinda a smaller issue if you're willing to put the work into it unless the type you chose lucks out for you.

Also if you're getting the Evo item for Ceruledge/Armarouge and only one for one evo, what about the other? We'd need to make this repeatable anyhow so you could try for the other evo item potentially, then it definitely needs to be reworked for both a chance and (to me) to be clearer that it's repeatable? Though rampaging Ceruledge/Armarouge COULD just be it's OWN thing, and also just either a requirement or recommendation for the Quest Starters... still feels a bit extra compared to Gen 2 starters with Quests not requiring a specific other quest to unlock them.

Then we could expand the Pier idea! Step one being descriptions of what's happened to the pier, pine, getting the people you encounter who explain what happened on your side. Step 2 being given tracks - possibly 3 or 4, with 1 for each (one way for Cer and one for Arm, and one as a decoy or as a requirement first for Cer or Arm, before the tracks to the other open up)?

That would then leave the next step to face Arm / Cer at least, and give a clearer indication of the work you're putting in esp for an evo item (still would think it should be rng, though depending on the amount of work involved we could argue for more favorable rng). Since you're not getting Charcadet in this quest less of an issue. Do you HAVE to have a Charcadet to take it? You mention "your Charc" I believe? That'll make this quest starter for actual Paldea Starters just. No. In my opinion. I'd be in favor of scrapping it as a requirement and making it it's own quest and the cats theirs then. A little much at that point for just starter quests. But I do like the ideas and directions they're going.

I can't comment on the other quest ideas at though as I gotta go back to work. X3 If we're talking 3-4 different quests it's probably better to break each quest idea up into its own topic though, so no one's talking over others for different quest ideas and missing condos on the ones they're working on. 💞

[vartio]

For Cara: It would indeed be four quests.

I chose Armarouge/Ceruledge as the intros for two reasons: Because we want to establish a plotline (establish the introduction of these Starter Questlines), so we'd need another Paldeamon, and because they're basically the secondary covers of Scarlet/Violet - which make them ideal for the introduction for the event. If we need to we can add fluff before it, or maybe make it multiple battles (one without Tera, one with Tera, maybe even one Herba Mystica + Tera Empowered), that would be fine too. Could even use that to add a more difficulty to the other 3 quests (or maybe only it has a Herba Mystica phase).

I have heard one of the staff plans were for one of the armors to be purchaseable from Faction Shops, and my idea was this one would be the opposite available. That was the essence behind this reward. It is an optional quest afterall. If we consider T4s (the starters) as 10 RT, this would be a similar difficulty 'boss' for half that. Charcadet is NOT necessary to own.

Lore wise, again, Arma/Ceru are there to have SOMETHING there to show poachers have brought foreign pokemon into the area and that the pokemon have escaped and started causing trouble. Its there to have something at the pier because it would start off this idea this isn't some small scale incident. It's also there to let the User/Player obtain info about the Starters to begin the further quests. This would be the "Legendary Trio" quest to 'Deimon in the Rough', just an intro with 'relatively light' rewards themed towards Gen 9, namely the Armor and Tera Shards.

==================================================================

"still feels a bit extra compared to Gen 2 starters with Quests not requiring a specific other quest to unlock them."

True, but it's more fun this way, don't you think? Yeah a bit more work, but that's why I wanted Ceruledge/Armarouge to be a one-and-done rather than a series of battles.

==================================================================

"Step 2 being given tracks - possibly 3 or 4, with 1 for each (one way for Cer and one for Arm, and one as a decoy or as a requirement first for Cer or Arm, before the tracks to the other open up)?"

Ooh that's an idea. I'd say that normally you'd get Armarouge (TR) or Ceruledge (IPF) as enemy based on your faction, otherwise if you lack one, maybe you encounter a random one. Since the two both have their 'feels' to them.

=================================================================

"If we're talking 3-4 different quests it's probably better to break each quest idea up into its own topic though, so no one's talking over others for different quest ideas and missing condos on the ones they're working on. 💞"

I imagined this as a questline so I figured it best linked together in a single topic, but you may be right. Either way all questlines must start somewhere.